Maureen Werrbach 00:00:00  Hey everyone, welcome to another episode of the Group Practice Exchange podcast I have with me today, Kimberly Parker. She’s the CEO of Revive to Thrive Wellness Center in Texas. But we’re going to be talking about today is being a continuing education course creator, and how to just get that approval, to be able to be an asset provider and be able to provide trainings that have seeds attached to them.

Welcome to the Group Practice Exchange Podcast, where we talk about all things related to group practice ownership. I’m your host, Maureen Werrbach. This episode is sponsored by Therapy Notes. Therapy notes is my favorite EHR, and it’s one that I’ve been using in my own group practice since 2014. They’ve got everything you need to be successful in your group practice, and they’re constantly making updates and have live support. If you want two free months of therapy notes, go to Therapynotes.com/r/thegrouppracticeexchange.com. 

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Nice to finally meet you in person sort of exactly. Tell people about you and like why is it that you know about CS and becoming a C provider. Because I know that’s something that people are very into these days.

Kimberly Parker 00:02:35  Absolutely.

Kimberly Parker 00:02:35  So again, thank you so much for having me here today. Maureen. My name as you mentioned is Kimberly Parker. And in regards to like what makes me qualified or why this topic is something that’s important to me is because part of yes, I’m a CEO, but I’m also a fourth year doc student and part of my program is learning how to be faculty. And with that, just this whole idea of being able to exchange knowledge and engage in this transformational experience with folks. And so after taking the formal class on teaching and learning about things like teaching pedagogy and learning styles and things of that nature, I realized how much I love that and wanted to be able to share that with other people. And so, yeah, I would say as a clinician, I’ve worked at all levels of care. And so like on the clinical end, that is something that I like to bring to the learning space. But then also just my background in education in my doctoral studies has also prepared me for this very exciting thing of teaching courses and teaching other people about how they can teach courses as well.

Maureen Werrbach 00:03:39  I love that, and it’s something that in 2019. So what are we, almost five, almost six years away. Oh my goodness. Holy smokes. I was about to say like 2 or 3 years ago okay. Almost six years ago I was doing some forecasting work. And where do I see trends going in our industry? And like, what ways can I pivot as an entrepreneur and as a practice owner? And so one of the things that I started was going through the process of becoming an nvk provider, a asset provider, and it took a whole year because of course, not even a year later, Covid happened and restarted, and that just slowed the whole process down. So I’m really excited to chat about this with you, but also from a perspective of like, I do it too, so it’ll be great to sort of bounce things off of each other. For those that are starting now, what I’m hearing a lot is just like the anxiety of like not knowing what you don’t know and about the process of getting approved to provide keys.

Maureen Werrbach 00:04:39  And so I was wondering if you could chat a little bit about I know you’re an asset provider, right? Correct. But there’s social workers and lefties and psychologists and counselors. And so maybe chatting about why you chose WNBC and like its ability to be applicable, maybe for other license types.

Kimberly Parker 00:04:58  That’s such a great question. And I think that’s the cool thing is, once you apply, you kind of have like an end to the NBCC. And so I remember not being able to get in touch with anyone when I was trying to apply, which is why I created this course. But then once I got approved, then now I have someone that I can ask questions to. And that was actually something we recently talked about is like, who can even have this credential? And it really can be any mental health professionals. So all of the licensure that you just mentioned. Now of course there’s different categories that we all fit into based on our education and our background and things of that nature. But yes, if you’re a psychologist or a social worker, any of those credentials you can absolutely apply to be an NVQ, a CEP, a little bit of a tongue twister.

Kimberly Parker 00:05:44  And so I started off with NBCC just because I am a licensed professional counselor. And so that was just familiar to me. And then also because I wanted to be able to offer my courses nationwide. And so that was the appeal, but I absolutely that’ll probably be another course coming down the pipeline is like ace and, you know, applying for some of the other disciplines. And it’s a little bit complicated in a sense because in regards to who can actually get that credit, you can also be of a different discipline, right. And still earn that credit. But I think, yes, as it relates to just making yourself a little bit more diverse and marketable in that sense, it’s not a bad idea to see what other disciplines are offering and what to apply for. But I just so happened to start off with WNBC as an LPC.

Maureen Werrbach 00:06:31  Yeah, and that’s what I did as well. I found that for the most part, that most of what was required for you to be able to offer a continuing education and have it be approved by a CEP translates across to like the social work and the left one? Now for psychologists.

Maureen Werrbach 00:06:51  I noticed there are some differences between being an APA accredited versus ASAP. Like, just as a quick example, one of the things that APA doesn’t allow is like business related education. So like we’re NBCC, you can give CS for providing trainings on like how to build a private practice or things related to that. I know that that doesn’t translate over. One of the categories is not on there is on private practice building or business building.

Kimberly Parker 00:07:20  That’s good to know, Maureen. That really isn’t a little bit unfortunate. I mean, I guess everyone has their own rules, right? I respect them, but it’s like this whole diversifying your income is so big, especially for the type of work that we do. It’s nice to kind of dabble in a little bit of this and a little bit of that. So that’s really good information. Thank you.

Maureen Werrbach 00:07:37  Yeah. So why don’t you start by telling people. Because most I feel like do start with getting the NBCC see approval but walking through the process of becoming an asset provider.

Kimberly Parker 00:07:50  Absolutely, absolutely. So I think one thing that a lot of people may not know upfront is that you don’t necessarily have to already have a course like up and running by the time you apply, but it is a good idea because of the materials that they require for the application. And so I think having a neurodiverse background like I do, it was a little challenging for me when like first and foremost, the application is nine pages and. Right. And then everything that you have to include my brain was like, but that was yeah, that was the part that really stuck out to me is like, you actually need to have at least actually, it’s two courses that you would already have in motion. Right. And then one course that you will speak to for your application. So I like to put that out there, folks who come to my course, some of them have created a course and some haven’t. But I like to let them know that at the beginning, it’s like you are going to need information from a course to be able to do your application.

Kimberly Parker 00:08:52  And so I would say it’s part the nine pages that you have to complete where you are speaking. You know, of course there’s like, you know, things you have to check off. Oh I’ve never done this or things of that nature. But then you also want to speak to the content that you’re providing and making sure that it falls within the content areas that are approved, and then also making sure that you’re qualified. So there’s three different categories that one can fit into. Making sure that you speak to presenter guidelines and things of that nature and requirements. So there’s that portion of the actual application. But then the supplemental materials. So like the survey that you give to your participants and then a summary of the survey, and then all of the different attachments that come along with the application. And so that thankfully when I was applying, I had already had a course in motion, a couple of courses in motion where I was able to pull that information pretty quickly, like the summary and things of that nature.

Kimberly Parker 00:09:46  But again, it’s okay if you don’t have a course in motion, because at least you’ll have and learn what you need to have for the application process while you’re in the course, if that makes any sense.

Maureen Werrbach 00:09:58  Yeah, I remember I was actually not denied initially, but like it wasn’t approved right away initially because of the supplemental stuff. So they wanted to go in the back end and look at like, how do people sign up for the course? They wanted to see what your marketing materials were for the course. And so I remember being like, I didn’t really market the course that I’m showing. I just like posted on social media one time. I can send you a screenshot of this. You know, that was like a lot of information that they wanted about the course that we gave out versus like filling out the nine pages. I felt like super overwhelmed by how much extra additional things like what is the login process like? Yes, I know for ASAP they wanted to see because it’s a, you know, it’s a recording, right? If you do that one, you you can get approved for live, but also for recorded content or non live content.

Maureen Werrbach 00:10:49  And that has its whole own set of requirements too.

Kimberly Parker 00:10:53  Absolutely. And I’m so glad you brought that up Maureen, because the course that I offer is for the live format. So either like where they show up to zoom at a certain time or if we meet up in person, but that’ll be the next one that’s rolled out is the on demand. Because you’re so right. That’s a whole nother process in itself. And yes, they do want to know, like every nook and cranny. And it makes sense because we want to make sure people are actually doing the work. But it can be a little bit complicated and overwhelming just based on the different parts of the application. And it’s not always the most clear either, I think, unless you’ve done it. And so I appreciate what you mentioned about someone providing feedback, because that was my experience as well. They had to tell me a couple of tweaks that I needed to make, but they ended up passing us through at the end of the day, which is great.

Maureen Werrbach 00:11:40  Same. Yeah, which was nice. It’s like if you feel overwhelmed by the application process and are afraid to click submit to, you know, do your best, but also know that it’s they’re not just going to deny you without first giving feedback to see if it’s something you can change.

Kimberly Parker 00:11:55  Exactly. And that that was one of my biggest fears, Maureen, because I’m going to be honest. Like, for me, $800 was a lot to to. I was like, oh gosh, okay, are they going to deny me and then just keep my money? But no, that’s not what happened. And thankfully, you know, they were very good to work with.

Maureen Werrbach 00:12:12  That’s awesome. So once you fill out the application and like you mentioned, it’s a handful of pages application with some supplemental materials. If you already have a course out there that you want to share to get approval. But once you’re approved, what are some of the common mistakes that you notice people making? I know I have one just in terms of like a future audits and stuff, but like, what are some common mistakes that you see or misconceptions that you see people having once they’re creating their first course?

Kimberly Parker 00:12:44  Absolutely.

Kimberly Parker 00:12:44  Yeah. So I think what I noticed is one of the hugest challenges is like creating objectives or having objectives that are clear and concise, because I know that’s needed for the application process, but also just in what you are offering your attendees. And so I really come from the school of thought that if I tell you that I’m going to provide you something in a training, I want you to walk away saying that’s exactly what I got. And actually going above that. And so not having clear and concise objectives is something that I noticed from time to time with folks. And then I would say the other thing, and I think this is where you’re going with the auditing. If there is a lack of organization, that can really be tricky because yes, they can audit you. I want to say every five years. And so with that being said, that’s something we talk about in my course tours, like different platforms to utilize, to organize everything. Because everything that you mentioned, like the marketing materials and the sales page and this and that, you know, all of those things are things that they can technically ask for.

Kimberly Parker 00:13:47  And so being able to have a solid platform to be able to organize all the many things, and that’s the cool thing in the I kind of almost call it like the ASP Bible or something like that. It’s got all the policies and procedures where it tells you exactly what they might request from you. And so I think just making sure to have those things handy and to have them organized by date, program, etc., etc..

Maureen Werrbach 00:14:13  Yeah, we use Google folders for ours because we have a lot of courses at this point in trainings that our staff has done. We have to organize, you know, like you said, the marketing material. So we we have a folder for every course we do that has like the qualifying presenter form, filled out a CV or resume for that presenter, any marketing material, all of that, the feedback forms and any of the responses to those feedback forms, all of that is hosted in there, which can easily get just very messy if you’re not organizing them in some kind of like folder situation.

Kimberly Parker 00:14:50  I so agree with you, Maureen, honestly, because I mean, if you ask me what I ate for dinner last week, I don’t know that I can tell you. Right. And so, like, certainly in five years, I’m not going to be able to just, you know, find all of this stuff. So I think organization from the beginning is something that can save a lot, a lot of headaches. Yeah.

Maureen Werrbach 00:15:10  So you mentioned you have a course and it’s on helping people.

Kimberly Parker 00:15:15  Absolutely. Well it’s kind of two part Maureen. So the first part is really about course creation. So I touch on things like teaching pedagogy and learning styles because I’ll be honest with you, I have always had the utmost respect for teachers and education, and I really thought that they were just kind of like putting something together and then just coming to class and teaching it. I didn’t realize there was a method to the madness. I didn’t I didn’t even know about all this teaching pedagogy and stuff like that.

Kimberly Parker 00:15:45  And so that’s part of what the course is about, is like, let’s actually talk about this style of teaching that you like to do, the type of learning that attendees need and all the different learning styles. and then of course, we go over the nitty gritty of all of the requirements in order to be in a CEP. We go over content areas and things of that nature, and then towards the end we go by step by step how to do the nine pages and everything to include. And then from there I also will give them kind of tips and tricks about marketing the course and different ways to maximize the course, because I’m also like a work smarter, not harder type of person, you know? And so like I will tell them about three different ways you can flip a course in which I’ve done that plenty of times. So I’ve created it for one thing, and then I flipped it in three different ways to make the most out of my time, and also just the course creation.

Maureen Werrbach 00:16:42  That’s awesome.

Maureen Werrbach 00:16:43  So you mentioned the marketing piece. What feedback do you have? Because I think that’s a piece I believe most people think is the easier part. Like, I have this great idea and once I put it out there, I don’t think people realize how hard it is to actually get enough people to sign up for something to make it actually financially worth it. At the end of the, you know, paying to become the provider, paying for your time to building it, and then actually giving the training. So what feedback do you have on that end?

Kimberly Parker 00:17:16  Absolutely. I think that by far, Maureen, I would say is probably one of the most important questions. And while it might seem like the easiest to some folks, to me that’s actually one of the the parts that takes the most time and energy, because I think you can create a course all day long and it be the most fabulous thing. But if people are not, if they don’t know you, if they don’t know your product, then that’s going to be a whole nother thing.

Kimberly Parker 00:17:38  And so I think it was what did they say? You have to think like and know the person in order to buy from them. Right. And so that’s something I think is the visibility piece is really making yourself visible, getting people to trust you. And this came to me when I started thinking about why do I buy things from people? It’s because I like them. They’re solving a problem that I have, and I trust them based on things that I have seen from them in the past. And so that’s something that I have been putting a lot of my efforts towards is visibility. In addition to that, I do usually hire a virtual assistant to collect leads for me. And that’s the cool thing about getting the NBCC backing, is that the course can be offered nationwide. And so I’ll have the VA get different leads for my email marketing campaign. I do a lot of social media marketing as well, and then connecting with other folks who are in the field, who their audiences, or they might be able to benefit from.

Kimberly Parker 00:18:35  The course, I think is another important thing is collaboration. And the courses that I have that are most successful, or actually the ones that I collaborate on, I do, of course, it’s not in BC approved because I collaborate with someone and we haven’t build out the additional application for that. But she’s a psychiatric nurse practitioner, so totally different field. But we collaborate and that course is sold out every time we offer it, which is pretty cool.

Maureen Werrbach 00:19:01  That is so for people who are interested, because I saw that with the type of support you give, you also help with like reviewing the application, making sure that they’re crossing T’s and dotting i’s before submitting it. If people are interested in getting support in becoming a CEP approved, how can they find you?

Kimberly Parker 00:19:21  Absolutely. So I have a mailing list that I can make sure to get sent to you. That way they can stay up to date on all of the trainings. They can also find me on Instagram at Kimberly Parker underscore, LPC I’m on LinkedIn as well.

Kimberly Parker 00:19:35  Facebook under the business name Revived to Thrive Wellness Center. And so those are some of the ways that they can find me. I will be offering this course in quarter four. Usually I’ll probably offer it at least once a quarter, just because I know that if someone can’t make it, they’re like, what? Are you offering it again? So I want to try to offer it at least once a quarter. And so yeah, those are some of the ways they can find me.

Maureen Werrbach 00:19:57  Awesome. I really appreciate you coming on and sharing your experience and your expertise on providing service and how to become a provider. So I appreciate it.

Kimberly Parker 00:20:06  Absolutely.

Kimberly Parker 00:20:07  Thank you so much for having me, Maureen, I appreciate you.

Maureen Werrbach 00:20:11  Thanks for listening. Give us five stars on whatever podcast streaming service you use and I’ll see you next week.